Do you like the planned sword nerf?

#1

According to some stuff that Niegil digged up from the XML files of the testing server, swords will get a good nerf in damage (about 15% fo the tiered ones)1. Now from what I’ve heard on reddit and in the game, most people seem to dislike that a lot. Personally I actually like the change, since in the current state of the game, melees get the best buffs, best armor/hp and the most damage, which is clearly too much. Thus it will be refreshing see some other classes become the top tier.
So, what do you think?

1Keep in mind that this is not the final update and uts will most likely get changed too.

What is your opinion about nerfing the swords?
What is your opinion about nerfing the swords?
#2

I think it’ll help. With how powerful melees became after pets, their damage being nerfed in return for the overall best survivability of all classes is a good way of balance.
Especially considering that their abilities all boost their damage - be it Warrior’s Berserk, Paladin’s Damaging, or Knight’s Shield - all of them enable the class to get more damage in than without using those abilities.

The increase in projectile speed (which I at first interpreted as rate of fire increase, for some reason) is a good addition, too. It’s especially noticable with Cutlass - high proj. speed - and Crystal Sword - low proj. speed - how much it matters.

#3

Gonna say no, purely as a melee lover. I’m selfish so anything that nerfs something I like is instinctively a dislike–even if it will be better for the state of the game.

Just like how when they nerfed abyss drops it was a dislike from me.

Makes sense though and the argument has been around for years, I think “nerf knight / warr” has seen the largest vocal supporters in the past albeit the paladin being more OP than both.

But I guess doesn’t even matter anyways, with everyone spamming LH solo grinding pots on a warrior, say, is less relevant so I won’t mind the decrease in efficiency.

#4

Priest?

#5

Debatable. I was wondering if I should’ve included it in my post, but I think that, with Knight’s tremendous defense and Pally’s own healing capabilities, Priest gets outclassed.

In a 1:1 comparison, then Priest may win over Warrior and maybe Knight, but probably tie with Paladin.

#6

Prot priest beats jugg warrior and any pally anytime imo

#7

I don’t like it. If melees need a nerf (they do) then they should have nerfed something else, what im getting here is an incentive to make people use UT swords

#8

we can’t just have everything being buffed forever, nerfs need to happen at some point. swords do a ton of damage already and sword classes are all broken in one way or another

warrior

  • absolutely insane damage
  • solid defense
  • access to speedy
  • dramatically increases group dps far beyond what’s easily handled by enemies

paladin

  • solid heals that bypass sick, when instant healing was never supposed to be a thing for paladin in the first palce
  • also increases group dps dramatically, even more efficiently in fact because it has so much range.

knight

  • as long as 1 stun makes infinite chainstunning possible, balancing around knight is simply not possible without making everything important stun immune, which is very frustrating for future designs.
  • ridiculous defense

nerfing swords is a start, but all 3 of these still need adjustments one way or the other.

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#9

I more don’t like the katana buff, because katana’s just got buffed and they’re fine. Daggers could definitely use some sort of buff, but I don’t know if you should just unilaterally increase damage and call it good.

Deca’s earned the benefit of the doubt on this, since most of their balancing so far has been good. Hopefully it stays that way. Hopefully.

#10

seems a bit excess or at least not well thought out

for the life of me, I have never understood how the knight is OP, especially with end game content I really do not see how knights are still the god’s people think they are. I’m confused as to where the knight even prospers? what doing skull shrines and clean tombs?

same with paladins

the warrior is the strongest but the thing is this sword buff does the least to him because of his attack.

If anything this is hitting the knight the worst

imo a priest is better then a knight in most situations, but I guess I’m the odd dog out and hes a just a god tier

#11

Melees are OP. They’re still going to be OP. This step that DECA has taken certainly hasn’t been in the wrong direction.

#12

the problem is that by simply existing the knight forces anything and everything worth fighting to be stun immune or it gets turned into an item chest. and because the only thing we have to work with is just making everything stun immune, the only options are either invalidate an entire class ability or make everything essentially harmless. there needs to be some sort of middle ground here that allows stuns but disallows chainstuns because the current all-or-nothing system is flawed and inflexible.

#13

if all goes as it has been going surely the first option will be a matter of fact for all endgame content

Yes, that makes sense there does seem to be an issue with the knights in the game

Though I can’t see how this would be fixed without bringing a large change to the knight, one of the oldest and most played classes. Such a large problem will likely require large change and with the knight, i would imagine it will like stepping on glass going forward with any significant changes

do you have an idea in mind of how they would go about fixing said knight problem?

also
This system being so flawed and inflexible is another to me that the knight in the current state of the game the knight has become a very average class that cant excel in endgame content

#14

yup, this is exactly why deca’s been too scared to apply any nerfs even though they are desperately needed. that doesn’t make it any less necessary though.

ez

just have enemies that are stunned become temporarily stun immune just like they do for stasis. it may also help to increase stun duration to 4s or something to compensate. that way stun can give you some breathing room if you can land the shot, but you can’t turn the opponent into a chest because they’ll break the stun eventually.

I can’t make heads or tails of this sentence, could you try rephrasing it? I think there’s a word or two missing that makes it hard to understand.

#15

Do you think the current dungeons that utilize stun immune would need to be changed to deal with this or could they pretty much stay the same

yes a separate sentence got combined into that one

What I was saying is that as of right now the knight is not very useful for end game content. If a class is not versatile enough to manage low to high-end content then to me it is just average. That’s why I don’t see it as a great class, with it not being able to make use of his ability in end game dungeons.

#16

I mean I feel like there are other classes that need a nerf more but eh. I guess I’m gonna be use skull splitter more than acclaim now?

#17

It’s not going to change the melee meta and will just cause more void fails.

#18

Because the system is so flawed and inflexible, it makes the knight a very average class that cannot excel at endgame content in the current state of the game.

#19

Keep in mind that daggers and katanas are getting buffed, so group dps wont suffer as much as you think.

#20

I think this was definately deserved.

Think of it this way: LH meta has become “bring all the melees, 20 of each”. Therefore if you want the other classes to be used as well, you need to buff and nerf things.

Daggers - no explaination really needed here

Katanas - i think this is to make ninja more viable, because samurai was already decent with support.
Nevertheless, ninja and samurai are probably the least used classes in halls (other than assassin) so this was probably nessesary.

Sword classes should not be the monster of dps and surviability. Nerfing dps is nice

I dont agree with buffing the melee shot speed, but for the sake of consistency between the 3 weapons guess its all right.