Mid/Endgame Players Levelling Character - How to make less tedious?


#1

Tales of a Lone Knight
"The walls around you blend into a blur of grey particles as you jog down the hallway. Constant yet increasing, the rhythmic cacophony - that is your heartbeat - pounds in your head and you wonder, as many have before you, how loud it actually is. In the distance, you see the familiar, familial corner where you’ve turned left so many times before. As you squeeze your eyelids with utmost concentration, you recognize two similar figures. Both are pale, squinty-eyed and reek of hospital disinfectant. One wears a blue robe, the other a red robe. You are now within proximal distance from them and they notice you, eyes-dead, face-pale. The mage in red reacts first, shooting a stream of fire though the blue-robed mage is not far behind and aims several commendable boomerangs at you.

You’ve done this a thousand times before and with deft movement, you swerve left, avoiding the fire and ice. Mostly. Your skin immediately blisters, it does not hurt, as an infinitesimal slice of flame touches you. Before the flame even touches you, your arm has already jerked outwards and the blue shield smashes the red-mage’s face leaving him stunned. You keep running, and a tiny smirk peeps onto your face. The smirk transforms into a grin as you see two piss-yellow obelisks emerge into view in the massive chamber ahead. What good luck. Two more piss-yellow towers. You give a small laugh as you smash the stone-switch into pieces carelessly and sprint back full speed, praising the unwavering RNGesus. A lone mage with a stolidly stone face approaches you from the left and you wonder where he came from. She. Nobody cared, nobody knew. You enter the hallway again and pivot around looking at the stone mage desperately trying to catch up with you. The smile lingers on your face as the mage get smaller and smaller, dwindling into the distance, but a cold chill, one so familiar, familial runs down your spine. Then you’re dead. In your carelessness, you had rotated and run backwards into the fatal grasps of the despiséd orb.

You look at the screen where the number ‘four-twenty’ shows up next to the bright-orange, upside-down ‘v’. That knight was freshly maxed, not yet two-hours old, and now you dread what comes next. Levelling. You close your eyes and rub the folds that had developed under them from hours of staring at a screen. There’s enough potions in your vault to max another knight, six out of eight, but you still cringe. Levelling. The infamous Train of Fame is at peak hours but you don’t like the idea of waiting in line for ten minutes to board the train. Not that there was ever a cohesive line-up anyhow. You call to your guildies for help, but they are all still in the Shatters, fighting the immortal evil, the omnipresent enemy. Reluctantly, you head to the pet yard where your fidelitous penguin awaits joyfully. The two of you head out on the beach and Sisyphus’ tasks begins…"

Ok… maybe that was a bit overdramatic but the point remains. Currently, levelling up a character is nothing but tedious to a mid/endgame player. There’s no reward, no ‘fun’ in levelling. In a more general sense, the majority of the space in a realm becomes obsolete once you reach a certain level; most of gameplay is centred around the godlands once you reach even 1/8.

How can we make levelling not an obstacle but something we look forward to? How can we make use of the wonderfully designed Realm (Amit’s map generation) instead of it being just a tiresome expanse of land that’s another obstacle when trying to get somewhere?

#MakeLevellingGreatAgain


What if RotMG had no leveling?
#2

just be rich and drink it to a 8/8 or at least to ahve lvl 20 stats, simple.


#3

I always gear up the level 1 then follow the quest marker until it starts pointing me at ents. Then I will follow the landmarks to find Midland hordes. I only finish the last level or two in godlands at the most.

I usually use exp potion. Takes like 10 minutes. It’s still great, you’re just not appreciating it.


#4

I disagree there. I usually wait until level 20 to gear up, limiting the risk of leveling unpotted.
Typically, I’ll level to 20, see if I get a good roll, and if I do, gear up the character and start potting it up. If not, I’ll just suicide it for the extra fame.


#5

That’s what I do to, until around level 10. Then I just follow people in the godlands.

Can you get those from the Tinkerer? I have zero :confused:

Rip. But what about my point regarding the wasted space in the Realm; don’t tell me you like to hangout in the desert by yourself because only Doc can do that.


#6

I don’t know where/when I got the XP boosters, but I have a bunch in my gift chests.

The likelihood of me dying with a full topped character using a legendary pet by following low level quests is pretty stinking slim. However, I have summertime drunk def before leveling because the roll had no impact on def.


#7

However, the issue still remains for the majority of players. You personally may find some charm in levelling up characters, by completing quests, but most people in the group I’ve described don’t empathize.

And if you think I can’t make that type of statement, just look at the fame train. Over half the players there are levelling up (just look at how much 100 exp green stuff there is) and what this tells me is they don’t want to level up the way you do. They merely want to reach level 20 and be on their way.

As for myself, I have found myself using the train less and less because the teleport delay and the lag I get. It’s not enjoyable at all so sometimes I challenge myself to ‘PPE until 20’.


#8

You could as far as to say that “level” means squat to a player in the mid/endgame. It is somewhat of a goal to get to level 20 for a beginner, but it turns into boredom for players that know what they’re doing. It almost feels that leveling is there just because every game “needs” a leveling system nowadays.

I am of the controversial opinion that you should be able to skip leveling once you get to 2 (maybe 3) stars with a certain class. What I mean is: once you got to at least 150 (or 400) fame in a class, everytime you start a character in said class you get to choose if you want to start at level 1 or level 20. Starting at level 1 is the same as it is now and starting at level 20 would give you a character with all stats at average, ready to jump in a realm and die again.


#9

the idea was great and all, but the rolling becomes weird. It basically takes out rolling, well, it would sitll be ok, b/c some people want to roll for + stats, so there would still be some peps lvling

then it brings us to prob 2, not much of a prob, but majority of the team lvl ups are from fame train.


#10

If you can’t be bothered/don’t enjoy the scenery change from spending 10-20mins going to level 20 around the map/via midland quests, or in Udl or hm well not manor anymore, the train works fine as a 5 minute+queueing time level up with brain disengaged.

& rolling your stats is a key pillar of the game, being an RPG, so I’m glad it is there. Plus the chance to save a bunch of lifes/manas with a good roll, or just to make your char more survivable with RNG on your side.


#11

I’m aware of the efficiency of the train, but by simply existing (and that people use it to level), it points to a deeper problem of the redundancy of levelling.

I’m not saying that we should remove levelling; variable level 20 stats should not be removed as you said. I’m asking how we can improve the experience, so it’s not just a ‘brain disengaged’ activity that serves no purpose other than to get a roll/level 20 character.


#12

I don’t know that the train existing = levelling is redundant.

Before the current godlands train, there would be trains of people running around the roads. Or everyone piles into an UDL/spider den and levels up like that.

People just co-opping to get the levelling done as fast as they can.

Edit: I’m not trying to be deliberately non-constructive. I think it’s more a symptom of players being spoiled by having (no surprise I think its pets again) too much proportion of their game spent at the “end game”, due to the massive survivability a strong pet gives. If the balance were better, the lower end of the game wouldn’t be as ignoreable.


#13

I should’ve replied to this.

You’re right. Powercreep has done bad things to the realm. The entire front end of the playcycle has been compressed a long ways. People get to 1/8 faster, and then get into what you are calling mid to end game playing.

Another problem is events. Some of the space on the map should be for events, which should not be charging curbstomps.

Another problem is liches/ents. The system for closing a realm is pretty weird right now - it doesn’t fit a narrative, doesn’t fit the play progression, it’s just sort of arbitrary. It could use a good rethinking, and ents/liches are just “off” to me.

You have to keep a decent size portion of the map manageable for new players. In a sense, the realm is the training ground and the dungeons are the real game, and I’m okay with that. But I would like to reinvigorate some of the mid-tier stuff (events in particular, and I don’t think the base “give it more hp” suggestion is sufficient).

But that’s not leveling. Leveling is a big deal to new players, and can be whatever you want as an older player. If you like a full on NPE or PPE, you can do that, or you can pretty much skip it (like I guess you’re saying most do). I find it to be a fine thing - it’s not something I seek out, but when I do it it feels like a trip down memory lane. Besides, it takes no time at all. It’s hardly a hassle.

Also, rolling. I hate rolling. It’s a complete waste of time. I could be doing tombs to get the life, and tombs are actually one of my favorite things. I don’t ‘roll’ my stats, I roll with the stats I’m given :stuck_out_tongue: .


#14

Well this brings me back to my original point doesn’t it? Getting levelling done as fast as possible might not necessarily mean people don’t enjoy it, but it definitely shows that people would rather just ‘get it done with’. Levelling up isn’t appealing enough for people to bother; as you said, people would rather do the end-game stuff and that partly has to do with balancing (another huge ambiguous topic).

I guess I can see your perspective. People have an option to skip or do it manually, but the fame train just seems like a really roundabout way to do it, not only is it boring, it takes me around 15 minutes total (waiting for realm to open, dc’ing etc.)


#15

I used to “roll” to get the best start possible but that takes time. I don’t have as much time to play RotMG now. Since I can afford it, I will max DEF on my level 1 class. Put on my good clothes (WC armor, ring, weapon and ability) grab my best pet and go level.

I will move toward Glands getting to level 5 or 6 then TP to glands and play with the Gods. Once at level 20 which is pretty easy to do now that I have max DEF and WC equipment I will max the rest of the stats and go play.

Kabam and DECA have made getting pots a lot easier. Just gland farming will get you all the DEF, ATT and SPD you could want in 3-4 hours of play. My timing may be skewed because I have a legendary pet, good at dodging and I use a very nice farming class (sorcerer). But, almost any 4/8 class should be good at farming. With the sorcerer I am getting pot drops on multiple gods all the time. The piercing and scepter are quite helpful.


#16

I don’t see the problem. Care to expand?[quote=“Nevov, post:10, topic:2399”]
& rolling your stats is a key pillar of the game, being an RPG
[/quote]

What makes RotMG an RPG to you? Im genuinely interested, as I’ve never seen it as an RPG. Rolling doesn’t even come close to being a key pillar of the game for me. In fact, it’s quite the opposite, sometimes hindering the very point of the game, that is, shooting stuff in the face really hard.

That is true, but you can’t expect that not to happen. In any given game, players will git gud and the early stages of the game will stop being fun to those players, as they know they can do so much more. It’s up to the developers to make it so that experienced players can skip the boring phases (without harming the experience of new players), by one way or another. Of course, that’s only my point of view.

The thing is, maybe there are too much experienced players and not enough new players. That’s why it feels there’s so much wasted space. We all know how the mid/end game places in the game are full to the brim with players, whereas the Early game places look like deserts, sometimes literally. Do people even find out about this game anymore? With the recent DECA takeover, it seems like only old players rediscovered the game, but aparently they’re not doing much to bring new players in.

I feel your pain. I adopted that philosophy recently and it has done me wonders. Still, I think RNG shouldn’t exist there, hence my idea. It gets rid of both leveling and rolling. Two birds, one stone.

#17

hence i said not much of a problem.


#18

Choosing a character to be, each of which has a different ability, weapons/armour/stats that vary per class, damage is calculated and numbers shown over enemy’s head seems abcRPG to me.

I think one of the greatest aspects of Rotmg is that its simple structure and non-linearity/freeform gameplay means you can ignore certain dungeons/quests/classes and just play whatever content you like best. There is no “oh you haven’t killed 50 Mad Lab bosses on dagger class, sorry that is prerequesite to join a Shatters” or anything bizarre to grind through.

If levelling 0-20 took a day, or a couple of hours… Or if the game was requiring a character to be on 250 base fame before it could access certain content, then yes we would have a problem.

Yes this is a pity and unfortunately an effect of the mature (haha not in that sense) player base, as once you have tasted maxed level play, godlands loot and tops, most players are not going to be happy running around midlands for hours looting a T4 Ironwood bow.

The graph of number of active players by rank backs up that the game is not very newb-heavy [looking at ranks 2-70, 40% are red star or higher], and that has a direct effect on lowlands/midlands being empty.

One of my favourite memories is when the game was launched/promoted on Kongregate and the realms were suddenly overbalanced with newbs. I would love it if the game had another infusion of players like that, and the lowlands would be busier again. If only to make tp-ing around to kill the quests easier for me. :wink:


#19

Fair enough, but those characteristics are not what define RotMG for me. This game is about shooting stuff really hard in the face (and then dying), you don’t see many RPGs with focuson that out there.

Also, you misspelled the beginning of the alphabet, it goes ABCDEF, not abcRPG.


Thank <insert favorite religious figure here> it doesn’t. But as Uni pointed out, we just wanna “get it over with” when it comes to leveling, making me think that maybe it shouldn’t even be there. It’s not compelling at all.

#20

After you get to a certain point in the game where leveling is an issue… It’s an issue that you caused by dieing or wanting more characters, therefore you should deal with it.

I despise the idea of leveling straight to twenty. Among the things that become an issue with this is that people will be more careless. They won’t try as hard, they’ll see it as “Oh, I’ll just go back into Godlands with a fresh lvl 20.”

Otherwise it’ll be “I am not looking forward to wasting 30 minutes leveling up, I’ll be careful and keep my characters alive as long as possible.”

My characters last a long time, not that I don’t take risks, I just limit them. I don’t roll my characters or hop in the fame train and I rarely die prematurely. All because you’ve got to have the mindset that you need to preserve what you have and not take shortcuts.

That’s my unchangeable view on this, however I do feel that double EXP potions should be more accessible, preferably with fame.