Seelpit explain your beework


#1

@Seelpit wants a nest rework please explain.

why seelpit currently nest is fun and easy why the rework?


#2

“fun and easy”
Allow me to explain the problems in a variety of imagery.
Problem #1: Confuse
Only on two enemies, but already much too deadly.
image
What kind of duration is 0.8s? Short enough that you can’t manage to switch over to Confuse controls in time, long enough that the game still uses them by the time it wears off.
And the Soldier Bees shoot off a constant stream of these.
On top of that, the Glaives aren’t consistent with their Confuse duration, even though they deal the same amount of damage and move at the same speed.

image
image
image (this one moves slower)
For the Queen, these three shots confuse.
The only issue here is that those Red Balls are pretty much everywhere during her 2nd colour phase.
But wait, that’s not the end of it.
image
The Queen’s Red Glaives don’t Confuse. Like we hadn’t had enough inconsistency.

Problem #2: HP
None of the enemies’ health is scaled.
None of them.
Any endgame dungeon in this era needs HP Scaling to some extent, or it’ll be big-group-or-you’ll-never-run-it-publicly.
The Nest currently tries to combat this by using the old “give everything 65,536 invulnerability phases”, which just makes getting damage in hard for smaller groups - damage that they desperately need.

Problem #3: Loot
Soldier Bees can drop their respectively coloured Beehemoth Armor, which is fine, as well as both the ST Armor and Ring. Nothing insane there.
But the Queen? She has an unguaranteed Potion of Life (which means that for once, less players = higher chance of getting something), and a disappointing Greater Dexterity, which isn’t worth much at all.
On top of that, if you don’t get that, you get…a mark.
There’s no other loot you can get from the Queen aside from the whites and the ST trap, meaning that it’s pretty much an utter gamble: you get nothing, or you get something disappointing, or something great.

Problem #4: Claustrophobia
Almost every room (including the boss room) is very tight, allowing for little space to move around with against highly mobile enemies. A single Paralysis means loads of enemies can easily target you since you’re more likely to be closer to them due to the narrow paths, and that’s not even taking Confused into account.

tl;dr;sb (too lazy, didn’t read, seelpit bad)
The Nest needs more consistentcy among shots, HP scaling, more or just guaranteed loot, and more space.
Of course, I’m not an expert. These are just things I can list for the moment.


#3

The current problem is that almost nobody is doing it.


#4

Well in that case, we have to look at drops.
Some of the most desireable items include: Stinger, Bee Helm, and the Huntress ST.

Stinger is a great dagger and Bee helm is as well, but when you put in the difficulty of the dungeon as well as the drops of other dungeons (Lost halls with a whopping 13 whites available, Shatters with 3 Whites that can be used on any class) The nest looks a lot smaller. Not to mention that its absolute AIDs unless you’re steam rolling it.


#5

The whites aren’t even that great: If you factor in the longer cooldown, then the bee helm has roughly 15% more dps then a ggen (which doesn’t really make a difference since warrior already has so much dps), while losing speedy and 4 def.
I didn’t get too play much with my stinger yet, but most people consider it worse than the sts/cdirk.


#6

I dont dispute this but,

Its not, is it? It gives curse, oh boy, when ant Mystic could do it better. It does damage! Oh boy! Warrior NEEDS more damage!


#7

I doesn’t need more damage but dps warrior definitely fun :smiley:


#8

cause the nest sucks smh


#9

“Explain your beework”
Please explain to me the last time you saw a group of random people complete a nest from an actual nest drop. Nest has the same issue as the void and colossus, too difficult or too tedious to do without organized discords.


#10

Having pretty much every enemy, even the weak ones (maggots in the case) inflict a status effect and shit like Armor Break + Confuse and inconsistent shots, is just bad dungeon design.


#11

I will not argue because the maid of doom had points plus I don’t want to be murderer in my bed tonight I am just a helpless scientist


#12

Yeah I think I saw you a couple of times in this “Nest” place, the room with a blue floor, right?


#13

Plus it’s not so much Seelpit’s rework as much as Mrunibro’s, since uni is the one actually working on it. In fact there was a testing session with a reworked nest that came out September 2018 (PUBLIC TESTING: The Bees are Back in Town) but who knows when it’ll actually come out.


#14

The joke’s just mostly that I’m campaigning for it a lot, cause hot damn do I want it =,w,=


#15

Yes that’s true meh for me


#16

It’s going to happen eventually, just gotta wait for mrunibro.


#17


I’m actually surprised at how much time has passed since the testing session. 8 months now, I believe…

To be fair, I get how Uni feels. Scripting/Coding’s hard when you’re out of motivation, especially if it’s a load of borken parts. shivers in Waterway Wringout


#18

Heh it was my first testing session I did, it’s really hard to remember tho