Yeah rogue needs more dps
StarliAS and JoshBros extra special discussion thread [rogue DPS]
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Are you saying that so you can have your very own, new OP class or in terms of balancing the classes? Because boosting rogue dps wouldn’t balance anything. You’re getting into the whole priest dps argument as well, and you don’t want to go there.
It’s not a new op class, It’s just an ability for a rogue. And it’s not a major change in the game. Warrior can go berserk, with 75 max atk, and equipped with a an acclaim, indomitable, or pixie, does the highest dps in the game. This is unbalanced too but it’s still in the game. So why can’t rogue do a little extra dps? It’ll still do the same damage if it were to be buffed by a warrior, no game breaking changes there. Unless of course you want to have the berserk buff completely removed from the game.
…which would in turn make the class op. come on, man.[quote=“StarliAS, post:14, topic:9111”]
And it’s not a major change in the game.
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Major or minor, it would still be a change in the game, and it would affect the game nonetheless.[quote=“StarliAS, post:14, topic:9111”]
This is unbalanced too but it’s still in the game.
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It’s quite balanced, actually. Warrior doesn’t have the tankiness of a Knight nor the sustaining capabilities of a Paladin. It also buffs the players around it. Tell me how the warrior is unbalanced in comparison to other classes.[quote=“StarliAS, post:14, topic:9111”]
does the highest dps in the game.
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That’s like saying the knight has the most defense in the game, or the priest has the best heal in the game. You’re just naming the strength of the warrior. Every class has it’s strength and weakness.[quote=“StarliAS, post:14, topic:9111”]
So why can’t rogue do a little extra dps?
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Because that would overpower it. C’mon man, invisibility and high dps? That would make rogue broken. In addition, when did rogue even have an actual bug/fault? It has it’s own niche uses just like every class. I’d rather you focus on classes that legitimately need a buff (sorc, necro, ninja) than the rogue.[quote=“StarliAS, post:14, topic:9111”]
It’ll still do the same damage if it were to be buffed by a warrior, no game breaking changes there.
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That’s a very game-breaking change. If you don’t get it, just think with me here:
What is the rogue’s ability?
Yes, it’s invisibility.
Having invisibility, what is the rogue good at?
Yes, soloing things is correct.
Evidently, you’re assuming that a rogue with constant berserk is fine because a warrior could permabuff it? Let me show you how your logic is flawed:
- Rogues solo things. A warrior buffing it wouldn’t make any sense - it’s put the rogue in danger and defeat the purpose of soloing.
- There’s no way a warrior would follow you around to buff you constantly.
- It’s like you’re saying “paladin seal should give berserk because it’ll still do the same damage if it were to be buffed by a warrior”, or saying “knight shield should give berserk for the same reason”, or even “priest tome”, and so on. See how this doesn’t make any sense?[quote=“StarliAS, post:14, topic:9111”]
Unless of course you want to have the berserk buff completely removed from the game.
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Not at all. Berserk exists for a specific reason, invisibility exists for a reason, stun exists for a reason. I hope you get it now.
Then please explain to me why the ST warrior helm paralyzes, even though archer is the main class that paralyzes? Or why the ST sword pierces, when piercing is only exclusive to bow and wand classes. Is this not as overpowered as a rogue that just has a berserk buff for a small amount of time? What about the dbow for example, it can 2 shot gods in the glands, this certainly isn’t overpowered as a rogue with a little extra dps! [quote=“JoshBros, post:16, topic:9111”]
Rogues solo things. A warrior buffing it wouldn’t make any sense - it’s put the rogue in danger and defeat the purpose of soloing.
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Rogues barely solo things now a days, it’s always another person that’s near it, plus I’m not saying
Orbs give berserk, and curse, which almost maximizes the damage a mystic can do.
Yeah this is pretty balanced, a class that can cause almost any enemy to just stop moving and attacking, make it receive more damage, while also increasing dps.
There are many classes that have an ability which has the same, or nearly the same, effect as other classes do. I’m pretty sure a rogue with berserk won’t end the world.
Also explain to me why no one uses the ST helm ;)[quote=“StarliAS, post:17, topic:9111”]
Rogues barely solo things now a days, it’s always another person that’s near it,
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Yes, but is there always a buffing warrior next to it? C’mon, man.[quote=“StarliAS, post:17, topic:9111”]
Yeah this is pretty balanced, a class that can cause almost any enemy to just stop moving and attacking, make it receive more damage, while also increasing dps.
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You’re missing the point by a mile. The mystic stasis affects enemies for all players, making it a benefit to all players. The curse also affects all players. The berserk is the only thing that the mystic only gets, and that is just to balance out the damage discrepancy with the wizard’s spellbomb.[quote=“StarliAS, post:17, topic:9111”]
I’m pretty sure a rogue with berserk won’t end the world.
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Nor will it make the world better. Remember the saying “If it ain’t broke don’t fix it”? Your idea is not needed.
Why doesn’t the necro have this? And compared to the other 2 dagger classes, the rogue does the least dps. Trickster has one of the highest dps in the game, and the assassin has 60 atk when maxed, plus the poison. Rogue needs a dps buff, in the form of my cloak idea.
As said before, necro needs a buff.[quote=“StarliAS, post:19, topic:9111”]
And compared to the other 2 dagger classes, the rogue does the least dps.
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Buddy what is your logic? Does each class need to be exactly the same? That’s like saying Knight has the most def of the melee classes, or wizzy has the most dps of the staff classes.
I’m saying that rogue needs a compensation for the lack of dps he has. And before you say “The rogue already has invisibility” Think how useless this would be when ANYONE can literally just walk behind you when you’re cloaked, and you’ll be dead before you can even nexus. So by having more dps you can kill things quicker before they kill you, and before anyone can walk up behind you and get you killed.
…if you have a problem with rogue/are bad at rogue, don’t play him. clearly the people who main him and love him:
- don’t experience the same problem as you
- are better than you with that class
- get better loot than you do with that class
- live longer with that class
- see the strengths and weaknesses of that class and play it accordingly.
TL;DR The class isn’t the problem here. Your playstyle is.
I am an excellent player on the rogue, it’s because I’ve been playing it for a long time, I know that it doesn’t deal as much dps and that is the main problem with it.
And also, you say that I am inexperienced with rogue when you have never gone past 3/8 on one, whereas I had 6/8 a rogue. And dying to a medusa? Come on! I thought you said rogue was the best at staying alive.
“I know warrior doesn’t heal and that is the main problem with it.”
“I know ninja doesn’t have enough def and that is the main problem with it.”
“I know priest doesn’t have enough damage and that is the main problem with it.”
"I know knight doesn’t have enough speed and that is the main problem with it."
Do I have to keep going on and on? Why do you not understand?[quote=“StarliAS, post:27, topic:9111”]
you say that I am inexperienced with rogue when you have never gone past 3/8 on one
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Classic illogical error.
First of all, I didn’t compare myself to you.
Next, my experience doesn’t have anything to do with the legitimacy of my points, especially when my points are based on many players’ experience - players who are successful and find no fault in rogue that needs attention.[quote=“StarliAS, post:27, topic:9111”]
Come on! I thought you said rogue was the best at staying alive.
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Lol when did I say that? Now I’m starting to question how much of my responses you actually read and how much of my responses you make up to support your point.
Then don’t criticize him if you don’t know what you’re talking about.
"Oh I heard from this friend that you murdered someone, but the legitimacy of this point is not to be questioned. What do you think, your honor?)
So you’re basically admitting that you have no experience with the rogue
You go off of what other people say, rather than finding out on your own. ANYONE can give you false information, that is why it is important to experience things first hand for yourself.[quote=“JoshBros, post:29, topic:9111”]
“I know warrior doesn’t heal and that is the main problem with it.”
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Warrior doesn’t heal? Then I guess that 75 max vit is nothing
That is a big problem with the ninja that I think should also be fixed
50 speed is the max for almost every class, like archer, huntress, wizard, necro, mystic, warrior, need me to name more? You’re pretty much saying all these classes are unbalanced because they have 50 spd. I’m saying that rogue needs more dps, which is giving every other class an unfair advantage when it comes to things like chests, oryx, and pretty much every other dungeon.
Maybe you should see a doctor
Knowing what you’re talking about and comparing situations on a person-to-person basis are two different things.[quote=“CandyShi, post:31, topic:9111”]
"Oh I heard from this friend that you murdered someone, but the legitimacy of this point is not to be questioned. What do you think, your honor?)
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If you wanted to use an apt analogy I’ll give you this:
Oh, I heard from more than 5 individuals that you murdered someone, but you yourself claim that you did not. What do you think, your honor?
@StarliAS
Not really. I’d just rather base my point on other’s experience, to not only make it less biased, but to offer an added layer of legitimacy to my points, whereas you’re only going off your experience.[quote=“StarliAS, post:32, topic:9111”]
You go off of what other people say, rather than finding out on your own.
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Oh no no no, I’ve found out quite well on my own, but in order to not be one-sided, it’s better to go off on other’s experiences other than your own.
Think about this: I give you a report saying that chocolate is the most popular flavor of ice cream in town. This is only my opinion, but I claim that because I like chocolate ice cream, it is the most popular.
Then, someone else gives you a report that strawberry ice cream is the most popular ice cream in town because 67 of 100 people surveyed in the town said that they liked strawberry ice cream the most.
Who would you believe?
What you’re doing right now if going off solely your experience with the rogue having bad dps (which is quite true compared to the other dagger classes, it’s quite obvious. Just look at a dps chart.). If you’d only said that, I’d agree with you. But then you said that rogue needs a dps cloak? As in terms of balancing it? That’s where I pointed out that rogue would be too OP with a berserk cloak, and my point being based off other’s experience.[quote=“StarliAS, post:32, topic:9111”]
ANYONE can give you false information, that is why it is important to experience things first hand for yourself.
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ANYONE can also give you true experience. Again, since you keep bringing up other’s experience in relation to your cloak idea, I revisited the post. I counted 6 people who at least bluntly opposed the idea and 1, maybe 2 people who supported the idea. If that isn’t enough evidence for why rogue doesn’t need a dps cloak, hopefully my former reason at last highlighted why this is an unnecessary idea.[quote=“StarliAS, post:32, topic:9111”]
Warrior doesn’t heal? Then I guess that 75 max vit is nothing
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In comparison to pally, priest, necromancer… Also vit/wis are becoming more and more obsolete these days since the introduction of pets.[quote=“StarliAS, post:32, topic:9111”]
I’m saying that rogue needs more dps, which is giving every other class an unfair advantage when it comes to things like chests, oryx, and pretty much every other dungeon.
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Don’t you see anything inherently wrong with this? Every class has it’s strengths and weaknesses. If you were to remove hose weaknesses, everyone would only play that class and have no reason to play any other.
That’s why priest has low dps.
That’s why rogue has low(er) dps.
That’s why ninja has less survivability.
That’s why paladin doesn’t have as much def.
etc.[quote=“StarliAS, post:32, topic:9111”]
(4. live longer with that class
JoshBros:
Lol when did I say that? Now I’m starting to question how much of my responses
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If you’re going to pick off my words like that, at least include the whole thing.[quote=“JoshBros, post:23, topic:9111”]
…if you have a problem with rogue/are bad at rogue, don’t play him. clearly the people who main him and love him:
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and you said…[quote=“StarliAS, post:27, topic:9111”]
I thought you said rogue was the best at staying alive.
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First of all, if you’re good at any class, you should know how to keep them alive for a longer time than someone inexperienced.
Second of all, if you’re going to have a half-assed attempt at insulting me, make it based off something, please? Otherwise you risk making yourself look stupid.
The point is that is that you heard it, making it invalid evidence.
You claim it because you heard it from others
Here’s a better example of false information being sent to mindless sheep that is actually related to the real world.
In 2014, Supreme Leader Kim Jong Un, told his whole country that North Korea won the World Cup, defeating
Japan’s soccer team by 7-0
USA by 4-0
China by 2-0
Anyone can alter things and lie to you, the only way to find the truth is to actually look for it, and not sit mindlessly listening to people on the internet from your basement room.
I did?[quote=“JoshBros, post:37, topic:9111”]
That’s why priest has low dps.
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Priest needs a fix[quote=“JoshBros, post:37, topic:9111”]
That’s why rogue has low(er) dps.
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Also needs a fix
That too[quote=“JoshBros, post:37, topic:9111”]
That’s why paladin doesn’t have as much def.
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Has a huge hp buff and heals? Maxed def is 30? Able to get the most strongest armors in game?
These are all healing classes, they don’t need vit[quote=“JoshBros, post:37, topic:9111”]
I counted 6 people who at least bluntly opposed the idea
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6 people who probably have never played/maxed a rogue
Honestly how stupid are you? “I’d just rather base my point on other’s experience” I won’t learn to do things myself, I’ll just go off what other people say, you know? They’re not going to lie to me because we all live in one big happy world.
You need solid evidence, it’s in The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, article 11. Study up butter-cup!
lol, and you act like you know all about playing the rogue and staying alive.