Twilight Gemstone Rework/Buff Idea

#21

no i am saying that every person who runs shatters NOW in a medium to large group/discord (i doubt you can solo, first boss is insanely hard, especially with the new vit update) likes doing shatters because of the loot. that’s it. not because it’s fun, not because it’s a great experience, but because of the easiness for good loot gain.

you’re telling me you absolutely love the first boss fight? sitting on the side of a “room” and negating the WHOLE boss fight? you’re telling me you love fighting twilight archmage? you’re telling me you love to literally LEECH during the forgotten king fight so his shots dont register? if you do love all those things, then PRAY TO GOD that deca neglects the rest of the player base in keeping shatters the way it is now.

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#22

mundane is getting deleted

#23

the fame bonus is, doesn’t mean everyone will stop being mundane. a safe assumption since i know that some people will continue to not teleport once boots is long gone

#24

Gemstone doesn’t need to be reworked, but also isn’t even close to being the best ring, and if you think so then you are just kidding yourself I’m sorry

#25

oh my god he is serious
wont bother to argue since it is opinions at the end of the day
rock with gemstone if you like it; you do you

#26

That’s me.

#27

bro that’s what i was sayin ;(

#28

Maybe crown actually needs a nerf? Maybe switch the mp and hp values on crown and gemstone could be a fun change

#29

Alright, I’m going to jump in here and give a few of my thoughts.

So, I do have to agree with @RareMeat for the most of this. That is way to high on the stats. Mundane people- and yes, there will still be some after fame rework, its a playstyle and can be fun at times- will have this as a default ring. That alone may not be enough of a problem with the damage side effect, but just take into account priest and any character with an ability that heals or inflicts healing. The balancing just becomes a minor side effect that is quickly undone. Not to mention that There will be at least a little bit of deterrence for this ring, with situations such as people using their ability to get is a fair bit of damage, then dying from a few more shots. For a ring that gives +450 stats to mana and life, the downside has to effect everyone and it has to be massive, but also reasonable. Eventually you just run into the point where to make more powerful items, you need a downside that is bad enough for one to not care about the benefit, and this is getting close to that.

I also agree here. Mana rings stand out against other endgame rings, because they don’t offer the survivability. That doesn’t make them any less of a good ring. Just because omni only gives 80 life, that doesn’t make it a bad ring. The mana build is a real thing, and this offers defense and speed to help with the survivability that the lack of life removes. It does stand out, as it doesn’t work on every class. You probably wouldn’t put it on a priest. It however can fit a variety of classes. Just because it doesn’t fit every situation doesn’t mean it needs a rework; the problem here is not its selective nature but rather rings that grant life having a universal nature.

#30

this is actually a great idea, and somethin similar that i mocked up a while back with sphinx ring (and kinda gemstone). i think that dungeons that offer a trio of rings (such as shatters) need to have some sort of obvious distinction from one another: the defensive ring, the offensive ring, and then the ring in the middle. your idea of swapping the hp and mp between crown and gemstone is a fantastic idea and i’m 100% on board with it. I think rings that offer a sense of “nicheness” or “specialty” should fulfill it’s role AS MUCH as possible. For example, monocle is a ring that specializes for attack and hp but specifically for invis characters. that’s it’s niche. but the problem is that items like crown exist: you could argue that crown is a ring that specializes in dps specifically, but you could also argue that it’s kinda a defensive ring with it’s hefty +110 hp. that’s the problem. because hp is such an important aspect to the community, any combination between hp and offense will almost always be the the community’s main preference. that’s why i think it’ll be a good idea to swap hp and mp between gemstone and crown so that gemstone can be the definitive defensive ring of shatters, and that crown can be the definitive offensive ring.

i’m sure a ton of people will disagree with us, simply because of how long people have grown on crown and how people end up depising gemstone (i honesty want to like gemstone, especially because of its sprite), but I think having Gemstone with 110 HP, 6 Def, 6 Spd and Crown with 110 MP, 6 Att, 6 Dex fits perfectly. You have your pure defensive ring (gemstone) and you have your pure offensive ring (crown). they completely fufill their niches and have their obvious specialties.

#31

Thank you so much for buying into my idea, I am for it specifically that it is the simplest fix, but your points on niche greatly help our cause.

Edit: Its also not totally about how I only get gemstones from shatters.

#32

I’m gonna give my honest opinion here…
Crown is a great ring, still one of the better ones for DPS (unless leather class w/monocle and turncoat cape, which isnt too reliable, but still solid)
Bracer is a great ring, but now somewhat outclasses by God’s Horn (hear me out, its 80 extra HP, 4 extra offensive stats, in exchange for 1 def and 60 mana. Bracer is better if you can’t dodge I mean, but God’s Horn is already solid as a defensive ring)
Gemstone is pretty meh. The one class I can really see this being used on is Assassin (which is a pretty fun class with the right items), but I would never use it over sourcestone. The lack of HP in a meta where most endgame dungeons deal too high damage for def to be more important than HP, or armor pierce, is a bad sign. Luminous Armor, the ST from Crystal Caverns is much better than Nil in terms of survivability in endgame.
Like, @RareMeat saying that the Gemstone is better than the 2 other rings will make you look like a clown in most of the playerbase’s eyes. Now, I’m not tryna invalidate opinions, but you can’t argue with facts. While the new buff is too overpowered, it doesn’t even fit the shatters anyways. The idea of losing HP with ability use sounds like something straight out the Para Chambers. I would rather focus on the Twilight Archmage:
His elements are fire and ice. Obviously, a reactive proc with slow would be expected. But rather, notice his lines “The power… it consumes me!”
I would think it would be interesting to have it fire a halo of projectiles every time you kill a monster (the way it absorbs a magi-generator). For every enemy you kill(new ideas welcome, wont do well in boss fights) a halo of 16 shots, released from the center of the player, would deal 500 armor piercing damage and have the 2 effects, weaken/curse for red, and slow for blue. What is the catch? You get a 2 second slow. The cooldown for the burst will be 5 seconds, and the stats could be upgraded somewhat. 125 MP, 7 Defense, 8 Speed. Being a white bag from a still-endgame dungeon, it’s stats just dont add up. Now it proves to be something that someone might actually consider using over sourcestone: 15 extra MP, 2 extra speed, and 7 Defense for 110 HP. I personally would still go sourcestone, but it changes things up a bit. UT’s are supposed to be situational and unique, and the gemstone just don’t quite add up as of now.

#33

Sure, cool ideas. Although the line “The power… it consumes me” is definitely something I considered with my rework, in the way the power of your ability would, by dealing damage to you, consume you. I thought it was thematic enough especially since the other shatters rings literally just give you good relevant stats instead of cool procs based on the boss fight they drop from but if that’s what you’re looking for, your ideas are very cool :smile:

#34

:rofl: I remember when and where that comes from

you dont need to, just highlight the text you wanna quote and click the ‘‘quote’’ button that will appear and thats it

I genuinely believe that Raremeat likes the dungeon. I mean, if I can like sewers then theres no reason for Raremeat to like Shatters

‘‘Doctor! Its actually learning! What do we do?’’

I wonder what is his response

I was about to say it dammit

@Inuarte, your reply to Kahlfin was a chat wall, couldnt read.
@AlphaCroc, same problem: its too hard to read

I suggest making smaller paragraphs.

#35

if you are too lazy to read, thats not my fault… and theres no need to ping me over it. i was just listing out an idea, theres no break in the idea where i can separate it into paragraphs

(btw, your reply was a bigger wall than mine)

#36

I wasnt talking about how long the reply is. I’m talking about readability.

Look I know it might be super lame to write like we’re doing english class, and that its just a forum we’re not at school, but I’m telling you some people like myself cant keep up.

And I’m sorry for the ping.

edit: if you dont want to get better thats fine by me btw

#37

I stopped arguing at that point by choice

#38

sometimes the comments with the “blockier” amount of text can add the most contribution to a concept. I think it’s safe to say that a good amount of people from this thread very much appreciated and literally liked his comment (i was one of them). just like how alpha said, it’s not our fault that you didn’t read the shit lmao.

^^^ same goes for mine lol

#39

smart.

anyways, at the end of the day, everyone has their opinions. i cant tell you “you shouldn’t like this” when you obviously like something. but the reason you like something deeply conflicts which a very large portion of the community.

shatters in its design and functionality of dungeon mechanics serves as an anti-dungeon: there are a plentiful amounts of “exploits” in shatters that are very potent to the point where you’re negating most of the dungeon itself in it’s entirety. it’s a dysfunctional dungeon and is a mere left over from kabam’s attempted failure of keeping the game running.

#40

yeah, i get that a lot