Wakizashi of Crossing Flames Rework


#1
Hey, you know that Waki that’s basically just a better Tier 6? The red one? Yeah, no.
It’s not like Eastern Winds where there’s a major trade-off. You just pay more MP, and get more damage, with it being much more accurate too. What kind of UT is that? – Not like it matters. You’re here for a reason. (inspired by shaitans rework btw)

Wakizashi of Crossing Flames Rework
(Description remains the same.)

Shot angle and amount remain the same
Damage: 450 - 600
Max Cast Range: 3.4
Range: 5
Shot Speed: 20
Shot Effect:
Armor Broken for 2.5 Seconds
Shots hit multiple targets
Ignores defense of target
On Equip:
+4 Attack
+3 Vitality
MP Cost: 110
Fame Bonus: 6%
Cooldown: 2.5 Seconds


This basically takes what it was trying to be, and makes it… that. Rather than being just added damage for more MP, you get to really do more damage, starting with added Armor Pierce. This helps with higher defense targets.

Next comes the Armor Broken. You could argue, “wtf op!!!”, but in actuality, it’s not severely powerful or anything. Compared to Ogmur, it has less time(1.5 seconds to be precise), less reliability, and costs much more(15 MP to be precise). Alongside these drawbacks, it also comes with a 2.5 Second cooldown, which makes it unable to be spammed.

Everything combined, not only does this give a better defining characteristic to the Wakizashi of Crossing Flames, but it gives more accessibility to the very rare Armor Broken, something only obtainable through one item.

If you have any counterpoints to anything, feel free to make them, but keep in mind I’m going to be firm on at least 2 Seconds of Armor Broken no matter what.


#2

P good idea

I would actually lower the shot damage tho cuz as you said it’s an accurate ogmur

An interesting idea would be having like one stream doing Armour break and the other crossing it would do another effect


#3

As neat as that would be, that would probably be hard to code, as well as really awkward to really use.

As for the damage,

400 - 500 x 5 (2000 - 3000)
vs
450 - 600 x 4 (1800 - 2400)


#4

Quick rundown:

Yeah, sure. I like it.


#5

Like the idea. Just because something has AB, doesn’t mean its necessarily OP.

To note: I used daze on a primary weapon with like 1% RoF and got bashed super hard for it. I feel your pain, not that anyone is giving you grief for it here.


#6

Don’t forget lack of Expose, bitch sir.


#7

honestly why do u make these ideas deca never reads them so yaaaaaaaaaa


#8

For fun, obviously.


#9

I like the idea except the Armor Broken… Maybe make it 1 second? idk. It just feels kind of OP to have 2 seconds of Armor Broken. As you stated, there’s only 1 item in the game with it, and there’s a reason to it:
It’s an event white, which means it’s not farmable like dungeon whites. You can’t buy Lotll keys and kill it over and over again expecting it to drop. Making that item drop in a dungeon would make people farm hard for it to get access to the unique Armor Broken status effect, a status effect that is unique due to it’s powerfulness and ability to make a group completely slash through any boss due to reducing an enemy’s defense to 0. In my opinion, it’s too powerful to give it access to people willing to buy 100x keys to a dungeon.


#10

Maybe make it 1 second?

1 second?

what

That would basically accomplish nothing. At that point, keeping Exposed would be better, because then it would actually see some use.

and there’s a reason to it: It’s an event white,

So? Dazed used to only be for Quiver of Thunder, but it was also given to Brain of the Golem. Just because something is given to an Event White doesn’t mean it has to only be for said Event White.

Making that item drop in a dungeon would make people farm hard for it to get access to the unique Armor Broken status effect, a status effect that is unique due to it’s powerfulness and the ability to make a group completely slash through any boss due to reducing an enemy’s defense to 0.

I think you’re missing the fact that it’s so goddamn rare to see an Ogmur outside of organized runs that it basically doesnt come into play. Hell, I do Lost Halls runs, and 60-70% of the time, I don’t see an Ogmur at all. A unique status effect doesn’t mean that it should be extremely scarce, it means that it should be taken advantage of while also not being so widespread that it’s a norm. That’s why items with Armor Pierce are rare.

The entire argument of “but it’s too common” is very lacking, as there are dungeons that people not only buy keys for, but run daily, that give items more powerful than this. Let me give you some examples:

  • Lost Halls
  • Shatters
  • The Nest
  • Secluded Thicket

Nobody displays any issue with people having a single shot bow that will always outdamage any bow outside of Nectar Crossfire, or a ring that gives you 110 Health and Mana, or a Sword that can outdamage Pirate King’s Cutlass, or a Staff that basically makes Staff of Extreme prejudice look like a fucking joke, or hell, a Robe that not only gives more Attack than a tiered Robe, but gives 15 Wisdom. At the same time, there are no issues with a ring that not only provides very good HP, but gives more DPS stats than both Unbound Attack and Dexterity, a dagger that pierces and armor pierces, or a Leather Armor that gives 8 Attack and Dexterity, as well as several other items that are way too strong for their own good.

Something being from a dungeon vs the realm has nothing to do with Status Effects. Armored is given to Cloak of the Mad God and Tome of Holy Protection, and both are from a dungeon, but Helm of the Juggernaut is from the realm. Should we remove it from those? It’s a unique status effect, after all.

The answer is no.

Also, people are willing to mass clear realms, too. People will do whatever they need to in order to get a white that they want. Currently, I’ve seen people actually upset that they got the Waki, despite the fact they have the Skull. Not to mention, there’s a Lair of Shaitan rework that’s literally on Public Testing, so it isn’t like it’s farfected that it’ll be harder to obtain the whites from the dungeon. Introducing something unique to one of the least unique items for Samurai is something that needs to happen, as all the others outside of Ronin’s are just the same thing for the most part.


#11

Sure, but it works very differently from a quiver and it’s not something you can repeat easily, plus you have to gather a group together unless you wanna spend an hour clearing the halls just to kill the defender over and over and even if you are able to solo rush it would be a big waste to just do the defender and leave, someone willing to pay for the key would atleast do MBC or Cult which would take more time. But back to the way they are used: One of them is a quiver which you can use from afar and shoot it into an enemy making it practical for bosses with few minions and another one you have to Teleport close to it and leave meaning that not every boss will take it, especially ones that don’t go after players and have weird movement patterns.
The waki and the shield, despite them being different abilities are not too far from their usage. Either you have a waki or a shield you have to get close, and use it. With samurai you don’t even have to get as close as a knight so you are not risking as much.

And that’s the magic of it. That item was not ever supposed to be everywhere. That’s why it’s currently the only item in the game with it. If you introduce armor break to a boss-only dungeon like shaitans (easy to clear and repeatable, you can do a lot of them in under 10 minutes), as i said before, people will farm for it and what would an ogmur be useful when you have 10 Samurais armor breaking the boss and you could be stunning? it would lose its usefulness or at least greatly diminish it.

First of all, let’s make it clear what we are talking about. You are comparing a dungeon of only 1 Boss (Shaitans) which takes 3 minutes give or take with an average group of 20 people and isnt really that challenging to some of the hardest dungeons in the game. You compare an item that drops from Shaitans to items that drop from an end-game dungeon, arguably the hardest dungeon in the current game which has a multiple Discord servers dedicated to gathering people, and doing these dungeons coordinated and takes around 10-20 minutes if you are fast.
There is no way that you can get Lost Halls whites in the same time frame as Shaitans whites, unless you are extremely lucky.
Sure Void bow might be very powerful but you don’t see people running with them everywhere do you? you might see here and there, for those people who do a lot of LH but it’s not a common sight. And just because it has the better damage output doesn’t mean you don’t need other bows. People with the void bow always have swap-outs as with any other LH whites except maybe the sourcestone.
A sword that can outdamage Pirate King’s Cutlass? No one uses that crap sword. Demon Blade and Pixie outdamage Sword of the colossus, what are you on about? Colo sword only starts outdamaging at 55 Defense for Knight and Pally and 75 Defense for Warrior. At that point few enemies actually have that much defense for it to be an “OP” sword, not saying it is bad because i kinda like it but you’re talking about DPS then at least check before saying anything.
EP outdamages the Cult staff until 40 Defense and all the other whites have boosts and nerfs here and there which make them great for some stuff but not for using everywhere. The way you talk about these items make it sound like they are a replacement for all the other items in the game when it is clearly not the case. Yeah, the robe offers +15 WIS which is great for WisMod but what about the lowered defense and the lowered MP? You don’t talk about those do you?
Anyway, enough of talking about LH whites, they do have their strong points but they are situational.

Dont mix apples and pineapples (or whatever the saying is, lol). A status effect inflicted on oneself can’t be compared to a status effect inflicted on an enemy. How can you compare Armored on a Priest and Armored on a Warrior? Exactly, you can’t. Warrior has a lot more Defense, which makes the Armoring effect a lot more effective than on a priest. You can’t tank the same shots an Armored Warrior can with an Armored Priest. That’s why you can only find Armoring on an event white for warrior. It is powerful and thus, it is limited to those lucky enough to get one from Herm/Sphinx. It isn’t farmable like Prot is. As for the Cloak of the Mad God, the same i said before applies and don’t forget that it is a white only available during MOTMG.
When you inflict Armor Broken on an enemy, whether you are a priest, assassin, knight, samurai or whatever class it is, the same people will attack and the same damage output it will give, armor breaking isnt based off your personal stats as it isn’t a personal buff, it only removes the enemy’s armor boosting the damage dealt by everyone. Don’t compare a stat like Armored to a stat like Armor Broken, makes no sense.

Mass clearing realms does not guarantee your loot. It might increase the chance, but for items as rare as the ogmur and the jugg, even mass clearing realms will leave you disappointed on how long it takes for you to get just 1. And it is one 100x harder to clear realms for event bosses than to buy a couple of keys that cost 50 gold and do a couple of shaitans.

Personally speaking, I don’t see why everyone is so against the Waki of Crossing Flames. Has anyone ever looked at the Skull of Endless Torment? It’s basically an upgrade from the T6 Skull with a bit of Radius nerf and nothing else, the Waki is just mimicking the Skull of Endless Torment but on the Wakizashi ability line.

To me, I don’t think an item with Armor Breaking should be added to a dungeon like Shaitan’s. Adding it to an end-game dungeon with a low drop rate, why not. I agree that maybe more items could inflict the Armor Broken effect but adding it to shaitans is a recipe for disaster.


#12

unholy sacrifice’s uses are far greater than ep’s and it pierces

oh no, muh 3 or 4 def and 25 or 30 mp. 100% makes 8 or 9 more wis for classes that have wis mod very balanced

“or a Sword that can outdamage Pirate King’s Cutlass

literally no mention of DBlade or Pixie from me because they’re multishot but go off

also the fuck do you mean “nobody uses that crap sword”, i see people with it fucking everywhere on any melee class

image

under half the radius, but it’s only a bit of a radius nerf. and, you use 5 less mp and get much less than 2x damage. sounds fair

failed rhetorical questions don’t prove your point, they make you look unreasonable

neither does doing tons of dungeons, what’s your point

“but adding it to shaitans is a recipe for disaster” he says, as an item that purifies status effects for an entire group in a huge radius drops from a dungeon in the highlands, and a cloak that teleports drops from the easiest godlands dungeon

let’s not forget the reskin void bow and the double shot dagger(that’s way stronger than it should be even with its amplitude) that drop from another godlands dungeon

and let’s not forget about how pixie drops from a dungeon that comes from an enemy found in the midlands, or how a tradeable off-brand cdirk drops from yet another godlands dungeon


#13

The last reply you gave me ignoring most of my points and nitpicked stuff to talk against me which doesn’t prove any of your points except that you’re trying to avoid most of what i said.

I would love to continue if you were actually considering my opinion instead of picking it up and slamming it against a wall hoping it will make you feel better about your idea. Since i see that this is going nowhere, it will be useless to keep firing back at each other.

Thank you and have a good day, no hard feelings. :v: