What if RotMG had no leveling?

#41

I’m confused about what we’re arguing about @RMGnoob with the ‘over 1 hour levelling’ thing. :sweat_smile:
If any player takes that long to level, either they’re doing something they enjoy - maybe subconsciously, or they clearly aren’t yet experienced enough to know how to shortcut levelling.

I hadn’t even considered the xp boosters when mentioning any timings, (I don’t use em cause I don’t mind levelling) - don’t they halve the time to more like 5 to 10 minutes with 1x UDL or abyss or puppet theatre call, clear it and you’re lev 20? I always use UDL so not expert on the xp from the others.

Anyway, we’re probs getting too mired in that.
My overall point is that players who don’t like levelling have several ways to minimise its impact (pay for the lev 20 insta pot, prepare for a death by saving an XP booster, use some stored pots to cancel a bad roll). And as a % of playing time, levelling is 2% of your time if you get 8 hours alive out of a character vs 10 min level up.

So any reason to scrap or alter levelling should be driven by the needs of the players who spend a large % of their playtime in the die->level->die cycle, as for anyone in this loop levelling is the core of Rotmg. Cut it away and they’re now pushed into fighting alongside all the 0/8 lev 20 players instead of having their own little world of undead hobbits and shambling sludges.

For ‘endgame’ players, levelling or whatever replaces it could never be interesting, because by definition they want to get back to the endgame content as fast as possible. So only something endgame in the level process would interest them but that would be weird/out of place (like trying to raise interest in pcave by putting a good white bag in there). I think we have to accept that for endgamers by definition the early game phases hold no interest. It’s just the same as how people leech dungeons because clearing them is no interest/no reward in comparison to the boss.

But okay what about this for a radical idea: you could choose whether to level up like normal (same as now), or spawn in at level 20 with fixed stats every time BUT the fixed stats are slightly worse overall than the RNG average. So you have the option of going through the time+effort spent to level and undergo RNG to choose all your stats, or skip levelling at the cost of overall it will be a bit worse, but you know what you’ll be starting with and can go straight into the maxing.

That wouldn’t be game breaking, would give a shortcut choice for leveller-haters. It could even be for fame cost to spawn in on fixed stats, to give it a ‘cost’. Or free I don’t care as I wouldn’t use it. :slight_smile:

Better map use/more interesting features, sure bring it on! But I’d want that independent of anything to do with levelling, like how quests are keyed off your level, but you still have quests at level 20.

#42

Re-rolling is a thing, and may save you many life pots. Of course swagger jabronis and paydtowins don’t give a fuck about any of that. 8)

#43

I used to care about that, but now I just save 4L/4M aside specifically so if I have anything above -20/-20 it’s being kept. I guess that makes me one of those things haha I’ll choose swagger jabroni thanks.

#44

Yeah, you see, here’s the problem. If any new player was level 20 to began with, they either will A.) Go to glands and scavenge for gear (more experienced) or B.) Not know what to do. It’s REALLY boring if all you can do is get a small increase form random stuff every 2 or 3 minutes. Its much funner to see yourself get faster, stronger, and have more hp. Also, please note this is an opinion, and realmeye really isn’t a debating website. (Is it?) It’s a discussing website :stuck_out_tongue:

#45

I mean, even me, an orange star, can easily do a cult/tomb for more fun and less RNG.

#46

Krathan made the parasite chambers. the only stuff he had to work with initially was the unused sprites from years ago. unfortunately the reason he hasn’t done anything since then is because that’s not his primary job and has a ton of other stuff to do like the chat server split.

#47

Eh. I still think that a company can have its own vision and the community can provide feedback and ideas. Also, I’m pretty sure most of the dungeons have been Deca’s brainchild with help from the community in implementing it. I see your point tho, and I can appreciate when a developer has his own vision and just basically says “Fuck you” to the community. I just don’t see how interest in the game would persist if Deca did decide to do that.

#48

Nobody said that removing leveling would not lead to any further changes in the game whatsoever.

Can’t be much of a discussion if you keep talking to an imaginary person in your head instead of actually reading what other people say before you respond.

I was just trying to give a wide estimate. Admittedly there are more players and Vit is way more effective now compared to when I started, so I might be a bit off. Also that was years ago.

Have you noticed how Deca has added a pot of max level in the game? Or how they made Exp Boosters easy to stockpile with Tinkerer quests?

It’s not even an endgame thing either, all you have to do to get 1 to 3 Exp Boosters a day is leech a bunch of easy dungeons and do something like 100 damage to the boss.

I don’t know man. Just doesn’t look to me like they think that highly of leveling either.

You’re saying that like making players actually play the game is a bad thing.

You’re also neglecting the fact that the best way to level is to follow maxed players around as they plow through godlands. Leveling up by yourself is what you choose to do, not the most optimal way to do it.

That would be a way to address this without having to put ungodly amounts of work into it.

Depends how much “slightly worse” is. Honestly I think I’d be find with a -2 across the board (so -10 for both Hp and Mp).

#49

Eh yeah, I’m not the smartest person. I can easily accept that. I also know that I simply do not have the time or dedicate the effort like Nevov or you. Just putting out my opinion.

#50

Leveling is essential for games like RotMG. If it was removed from the game, a giant portion would fall apart because it’s sort of like it’s theme - leveling up, getting better, trying again. I understand why you feel like the RNG is messing up the game, and the idea of removing that part is very debatable.

@seelpit has a point here.

And besides, if the leveling system was removed completely, what would happen to the class unlocking thing? Would it disappear? I know a lot of players who wouldn’t mind if you could start with any class from the beginning, so this is very debatable as well.

Overall, I’m not completely happy with the RNG of the stats when leveling, but I do feel like leveling is very necessary.

#51

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