Now hear me out, I’ve been a huge proponent of rogue being the best leather class for a while now. But frankly, the bloody cloak which I’ve heard is supposedly the strongest Cloak in the game yet feels Terrible to use. Imo the tiered cloaks are better dps cloaks as is. The attack buff does not even have a 100 % uptime making it relatively useless. also tiered cloaks have amazing dps stats just on equip, meanwhile i have to set my speed to 0 just to taste some amount of measly dps stats on a high speed class anyways. adding to the fact that a t6 cloak only costs 85 mp on use and doesn’t inflict a crippling debuff to its user just makes it seem like the more informed choice.

At this point i am convinced that anyone who uses a bloody cloak does so for the brownie points and doesn’t actually care about playing the game to its full potential

Also while i am on this topic, i do feel that cloaks should have a theoretical 100% uptime as rogue really shines when he is invisible, and all other buffs in this game have a 100% uptime. Personally i use turncoat cape on rogue for the 100% uptime on invis and it also helps me piss off leechers who try to tp after i rush a toxic sewers.

Moving onto the Dammah whites, Superior isnt even the best staff in the game, The cult staff is. once you learn the unique quirk of using the staff of unholy sacrifice, you will come to realise its true potential, its basically pixie for staves.

Moving on to the robe and ring, i just do not understand why deca seems to think its players want to get willingly hit by shots just to do a couple thousand damage. if you desire to have a dps ring, just use battalion banner as it achieves the same purpose as cranium but does so at a significantly safer distance.and the damaging buff doesnt hurt either.

Also, whats the deal with Magical Lodestone? imagine you complete 50 + mbcs, looking for a bplate and all you get from your white bag is a shitty omni which doesnt even have any hp or mp on it like the former.

To be really honest, i am sick of the current meta and how dickriders keep defending it while the game and all its supposedly endgame uts are in such a sorry state.


You trolling?

  1. not 100% uptime does not mean useless… In fact in some high req runs, bloody cloak is a required swap out. Additionally, it can be glitched with normal tiered cloaks for permanent buff without the negative effect! Although it should not in fact be your only cloak, it is in fact very strong!
  2. 100% uptime on rogue, although alright for endgame, is stupid in non endgame. Wooh. I can rush all the dungeons without ever being shot at. There’s no way thats balanced in any way.
  3. Superior isn’t the best at all times. In fact the best singular staff is probably t14. However, at it’s range, it’s able to do stupid amounts of damage. Although Cult Staff can do more at it’s own true range, cult staff’s true range is a good 3 tiles less than superior’s.
  4. Bruh I can’t tell if you’re trolling on the robes and rings. “A few thousand damage”. Also, even if you entirely ignore the skull summoning effects, you have to realize that both Diplo and Cranium offer a good amount of survival stats and the skill is more of just a bonus then it’s only feature. Althouh cranium in fact does require taking hits to do dps, that’s why it’s often only considered a dps item on melees and katana classses. If you’re doing endgame dungeons and not taking any hits, you’re either a legend or should be pushing in more.
  5. On no. Potato. WDYM? It gives 12 dps stats, tying it for second highest dps ring in the game and additionally gives you 6 speed (which is useful for running away from bosses with) or 6 def (nice in dungeons like fungals and nest to just be a bit more tanky). It doesn’t give hp, which hurts, but is definitely a valid ring to carry around when you don’t have a hp alternatie.


Where is the downvote button?


This I can agree.

As passive DPS boost yes.

Possibly to balance out the DPS boost from Bloody. But yes, needs a major buff as event white.

More than just Sew. Can be Tomb, OT and other dungeons too. You should perma-cloak just like a Warrior can perma-Berserk.

Superior vs Unholy Sacrifice argument is rare nowadays. Most DPS junkies believes Superior is BiS due to DPS it can deal with certain drawbacks. But you are right about Unholy Sacrifice have its actual use, crowd control DPS.

It’s like saying Enforcer vs Valor where both Katanas have their actual uses.

Both Banner + Cranium have their actual uses. Banner can indeed provide safer DPS boost than Cranium though you need to be sitting duck while at it.

Buff Cranium or something else?

Potato ain’t that bad IMO. It still have its legit uses (providing most Speed with high DPS stats). Omni is more of “jack of all trade, master of none” endgame accessory.

Speaking of which, I heard a forumer once suggested revert the Potato buff but in exchange, give 50 HP to compensate. Don’t know if this is good rebalance suggestion for you.

I personally don’t like meta as well. Hell, I just had heated arguments about meta in other game on a Discord server. I failed to out-argue, mods labelled my arguments as “trolling” and got muted for 5 days.

Aside from that… I think we need another wave of item rebalances. Buff powercrept + undesired whites and nerf the BiS one?


Not every second spent on this game is a high req discord run. I don’t spend all day with a 12 year old RL with their dick in my ears. Trust me, it’s how the game is meant to be played: In the realm. Discord raiding should not be used as a basis for everything. Also, not 100% uptime is pretty shit. Imagine Damaging or Berserk without 100% uptime. Kinda bad huh? When you really take a step back to think about it, what this guy is saying kind of makes sense.

It is balanced. Not everyone has the necessary gear to achieve 100% invisibility uptime. So I feel like those who have obtained that necessary gear should be able to play they way they want to. Rogue is already a class that is direly in need of a rebalance, so I feel no need for them to be worse.

Uhhh… What is 6 def going to do when most endgame shots armor pierce of do upwards of 200-300 damage? Def is pretty much a joke stat in endgame dungeons. I’m surprised that people still use x gives y def as an argument for why rings are usable. The argument might be valid in midgame areas, but it is an invalid argument in endgame dungeons.


the fact that people aren’t spending all their time doing high end discord runs DOES NOT CHANGE THE FACT that bloody cloak is a good cloak. Are you going to argue that mercy’s bane is a bad armor because not everyone spends on their time on high req discord runs and mercy’s bane doesn’t offer good survival stats. Good dps items are good dps items regardless of whether or not there’s a discord run. The reason I pointed out that some high req discords require it was to point out how important a little bit of dps can matter.

Nope. 100% invisibility is in no way balanced. It just means that for dungeons where invisibility does matter, you’re entirely invincible. The reason rogue is considered garbage in endgame is because it lacks the one thing every other class has… dps. Plus, while there is a group around, your entire ability, if it doesn’t provide anything other then invisibility, is entirely useless. 100% invisibility doesn’t fix any of that. It just makes you invincible in midgame and still pretty much useless in endgame. Also, as pointed out by the author himself, 100% uptime can be used to prevent people from tping when you rush leading to just purely toxic behavior.

EDIT: I think we have a misunderstanding. I wasn’t talking up semi 100% with the proper gear. I was talking to the op stating that

SPEED. In non o3 non shatters dungeons, def is nice. in o3, it offers the one stat in the game just as important as hp. SPEED. More speed = easier dodging = tank less shots. Although it’s obviously not neccessary on every class, neither are most rings. Sure Potato is not as great in shatters for average players. But, at least for me, neither is any other dps ring. I just use deca and hide… (shatters still scary)


I mean unholy sacrifice doesn’t really work with many abilities. Back when conflict was seen as BiS, unholy sacrifice was considered a solid option on mystic. However, now that Arcana is seen as BiS, unholy sacrifice shoots in the wrong direction. It’s a great option for when you’re soloing (working with st orb and conflict when there’s no buffs around) but in groups, superior is logically often considered superior. Still I think t14 staff is considered BiS but might just be me.

Flag does 2k damage average over 10 seconds (500 average a second for four seconds and a 10 second cd). Cranium does 3750 average over 5 seconds (or assuming you take hits instantly 7500 damage over 10 seconds). Cranium comes with better stats (120 hp 6 def 3 dex) as opposed to flag’s (90 hp 4 spd 4 dex). Flag has aoe. Cranium follows the user. If there’s no paladin around, banner is in fact superior. However, with a paladin already, as long as you’re tanking shots anyway, cranium is a strong ring. Although it’s only strong on melee ranged classes (unless you like tanking shots as a ranged), it is in fact really strong on melees, offering a lot of damage at a range people normally can’t achieve


I strongly disagree with cloaks needing 100% uptime. It would render all sorts of content trivial, everything from Abyss to Tomb, as nothing in there shoots at a cloaked player. It’s already pretty easy to rush them with Rogue but the 1 sec or more you’re uncloaked means you cannot do it on autopilot, you need to be paying attention and not let your cloak wear off in a too dangerous position.

Of course developers would notice this, and as they’ve done already for unbalanced content, nerf it or counter it, whether by re-introducing cooldown or making even more enemies behave differently near cloaked players. Rogue has already been singled out by such changes (quiet cancelling invisibility, enemies in various dungeons having anti-invisibility), they’re not now going to remove cooldowns and make more work for themselves.


Full disclosure to keep in mind for bias, potato is one of my favorite rings, and fungal is my favorite dungeon and i’ve done 2200 or so of them

The 6 def isn’t insignificant in endgame dungeons, especially while clearing. I’m thinking mostly in fungals here, where the small minions deal mid range damage, and the danger is from the amount of shots rather than high damage of individual shots for most spawns you encounter, and in this case, the def is absolutely a large benefit. I can’t speak as much for other exalt dungeons, cuz well, i rarely do them, but also for fungal boss (not crystal boss, FUNGAL boss) an instapop is rare, really only if you sit on something, and a lot of deaths are due to getting whittled down by smaller shots, again where def is useful.
The final phase of cwm is really where the def won’t help, with the armor piercing shots, but the potato also gives you 6 speed to maneuver better in it.

In general, potato is a ring that requires more skill to use than other rings, yet is not in need of a rework or buff imo.


That’s why I said DEF. Nowhere in my paragraph did I utter a single word that read “speed”, because SPD is a god stat.

It’s not a bad armor, but I definitely can make a stance that it’s not a good armor. Say your average player who does not really know how to play the dungeon. Will they a) Push in because they have 14 DPS stats or b) leech because their armor doesnt give much defensive stats and it’s also not your run of the mill acrop?

There is more to an item than how it changes the slope and Y intercept of your DPS line. If you are taking everything to face value instead of thinking about how this item can be practically used in the game, you aren’t really using the DPS calculator properly. The DPS calculator is a perfect scenario viewer where you are pushed in 100% of the time and you land every single shot. You probably know that this doesn’t happen in the actual game.

It really is. I run every dungeon in the game, yes, even pirate cave when I start a fresh character. 6 DEF in early and mid dungeons is useful. 6 DEF in endgame dungeons is pretty trash. DEF is overall, a joke stat if you can just dodge the shot instead. It is only a real stat when low damaging shots are unavoidable. Even in fungal clearing, 6 DEF is honestly not worth that much. The enemies already do a sizable amount of damage, and 6 DEF would not let robe classes not get put in combat, and a melee class would much rather have HP over the amount of DEF they already have.


That’s a rather weak argument. Tablet is largely considered the strongest spell in the game but if you’re new and can’t aim, a t6 would be stronger. Colo is considered the strongest sword in the game but if you can’t aim it, it’s worthless. PLUS, you yourself just argued that def is useless anyway so mercy would logically be just as good as any other armor except it comes with extra dps.
Also potato’s use comes from the fact that it offers two stats. Neither are insane but it’s the fact that you get both that makes potato a solid ring


The way I think cloaks should be balanced is:

Players should be able to teleport to invisible players.


Bloody cloak + Tiered Cloak + Monocle = +33 atk, +5-6 dex, +20-40mp, +160-180hp, no slowing effect

Without the Bloody swapout, you get 13 less atk with only the Monocle and Tiered Cloak. Bloody essentially becomes an extra dps ring on a rogue with the right set up.

Explanation to why

Bloody gives the +25 atk buff which can be permanently maintained by Monocle as long you’re shooting while invisible.

Swap out the Bloody with T6 Cloak, the 3 second slowing goes away, but the +25 atk buff doesn’t with Monocle. Along with the Monocle’s inherent stats, and the T6 Cloak’s inherent stats, Bloody becomes one of the best swapout cloaks in the game.

Edit: I read the rest of the post, time to write again

Cult Staff

The main problem with cult staff isn’t that it’s hard to use, rather the problem is that it renders nearly every single ability mystic and wizard classes use completely useless:

  • You can’t spell bomb with most spells in the same direction as the cult staff
  • You can’t curse with most orbs in the same direction as cult staff

There are only very few things that actually work in tandem with cult staff (such as skulls, kinda), such as the orb of conflict. Ironically, cult staff also works with dammah’s robe and ring, due to being in close combat with the staff.

Just like how very specific items make bloody viable, only a small pool of items can make cult staff viable.


While battalion banner boasts impressive dps increase, the damaging buff cannot be permanently upkept. On top of that, you have to stand in a designated area to receive the buff, which is not the case in a lot of dungeons. Meanwhile, cranium and robe don’t just have impressive equip stats (banner has only 90hp, 4 spd & 4 dex compared to the other hp of rings?), it can be theoretically be upkept permanently as long as you get hit, (cranium on knight is a good example).

Magical Lodestone (aka Potato)

Potato gives around an +24% increase to your dps, along with survivalbility stats (def & spd). That’s more than a reason to use it, similar to why you would use a mercy: sacrifice survivability for dps. Sure there are better rings to use, such as horn, or crown, but potato is still a good alternative.


This has to be a copy pasta right?


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